What do you get when two horror fans mind meld during some raucous summer fun? Nazisploitation / horror flicks of course! Following “Operation: Nazi Zombies”, David B. Stewart and John Martineau have teamed up once more for the anticipated “Reichsfuhrer SS” and we were fortunate to speak with them about the origins of this throwback film centering on Heinrich Himmler’s journey into Hell.
Body Count Rising: David, in 1992 you founded S&H Productions with Sean Hutcheon. Why was the transition to Dapper Cat Pictures necessary in 2011?
David B. Stewart III: Sean and I were very good friends all through school. In 1995 we made our first feature a fan film “Friday the 13th Part X – To Hell and Back” which has developed its own cult following. After high school we made “Maplewoods” aka “Operation: Nazi Zombies” together, but in our early 20’s we all went off in our own directions just because, well, that’s life right?
Regarding "Dapper Cat", in 2008 I got a very young kitten that I had to take over mothering, bottle feeding it every day for weeks. This kitten grew up to be the best cat I ever owned. He was truly special. When he was about two-years-old he developed asthma. Over time his condition grew worse and the attacks were more frequent and longer lasting. By 2013 he was struggling to for every breath and the medicine was no longer working. My heart was broken. I stayed with him until the very end. Anyway, sad stories aside, being a tuxedo cat I decided to honor him as my mascot and settled on Dapper Cat Pictures.
Body Count Rising: That’s so sad, and beautiful. What a wonderful way to honor your feline companion. You and John must have some interesting stories leading up to the release of the film “Operation: Nazi Zombies”…
David B. Stewart III: Well, I met John working on the hayride at the Bucks County Haunted Woods back in 98’. I was one of the crew and set designers. John was an actor, and I think he was working as an executioner in one of the scenes. This hayride was AWESOME! It was almost 75 minutes and over three miles of trails along the Delaware River in Upper Black Eddy, PA.
John Martineau: 1998! Holy shit I feel old! We got to talking and he told me about this idea he had for this film called “Maplewoods”. A few months later he held auditions and the rest is history!
David B. Stewart III: Oh yeah, we had A LOT of parties that year and John and I talked a lot about movies and stuff. I think we really became close friends during the shooting of “Maplewoods”. Between filming and the release we hung out at bars a lot, shooting pool and chasing girls. (laughing)
John Martineau: As far as chasing girls, I think I do remember most running in the opposite direction. (laughing)
Body Count Rising: So who originally came up with the plan to make a Nazi zombie film?
John Martineau: It was 100% Dave’s creation.
David B. Stewart III: “Maplewoods” became “Operation: Nazi Zombies” because Brain Damage Films wanted to change the name from “Maplewoods” to something more catchy. I thought of “Operation: Nazi Zombies” because of the plot’s back story; the keyword being “Operation”, and as with most military campaign names, it was just catchy. The reality is quite different. Anyway I still call it “Maplewoods”.
Body Count Rising: Did you know what you wanted to do right away, or did the vision evolve over time?
David B. Stewart III: I wrote “Maplewoods” during the summer of 98’ on my days off while working at Bucks County Haunted Woods. I lived at the Indian Rock Inn in Upper Black Eddy in this neat old 1700’s building with fourteen bedrooms that employees used as a dormitory. Actually it was more like a co-ed fraternity with an old restaurant and bar downstairs. I put the team together that fall. John became part of the project first as an actor, then as a cameraman. He earned a producer credit during post-production and was a huge help throughout that whole process.
Body Count Rising: So John, you produced both “Maplewoods” and now the latest of your Nazi horror films, “Reichsfuhrer SS”. You also worked in front of the camera and behind the scenes. How did your role differ for each film?
John Martineau: Both were actually quite similar as far as the work was concerned. In both cases I spent much more time running the camera. I shot most of “Reichsfuhrer SS” myself with the exception of the “Eastern Front” scene and the “Hell” scenes. I implored the help of the only other camera man I could trust to shoot things the same: Christian Jude Grillo (“Deer Crossing”, “Apocalypse Kiss”).
Body Count Rising: David, you pay homage to “Maplewoods” in the new “Reichsfuhrer SS”, but this is a very different film. Why did you feel this story needed to be told?
David B. Stewart III: I am intrigued by the human psyche. It is shocking to me what human beings choose to do to one another in the names of politics, religion, etc... I wrote about Heinrich Himmler because as the Reichsfuhrer-SS he orchestrated the whole machine that was behind the Holocaust and some of the worst war crimes in human history. The scary thing was he was more “normal” than most people think, at least before he became a Nazi. Power made him a psychopath. I believe the story of Heinrich Himmler could be applied to many people. It’s easy for power to go to ones head. I think it’s something that could happen again should the wrong person gain that power. In a way it’s a cautionary tale.
Body Count Rising: Of course you took liberties with the historical aspect…
David B. Stewart III: Yes. “Reichsfuhrer SS” is a mixture of historical fact and my own fiction. There is no evidence that Heinrich Himmler actually ever killed a single living person with his own hands. Angelina Leigh’s character “Danuta” is representative of the victims of the holocaust. Now the story about Himmler getting sick at the execution was true. This intrigued me. It’s also fun to think about a Nazi leader in Hell. It is fascinating to think of what Hell would be like for Heinrich Himmler. In the case of “Reichsfuhrer SS”, the audience would be rooting for the demons, who in most movies are the “evil” ones, but in “Reichsfuhrer SS” Himmler is the “evil” and the demons are representative as the triumph of good over evil, or in this case evil over more evil.
Body Count Rising: What types of films inspired the style of “Reichsfuhrer SS”?
David B. Stewart III: I am a fan of the Nazisploitation films from the 1960s and 70s. I drew a lot of inspiration from those films. There are a ton of Easter eggs where we pay homage to films of that time and history itself. I am also inspired by the monster movies of the 30s. I think 20th century monsters can be made into their screen monster personas much like the 1930s movies did for Vlad Dracula, Jack the Ripper, etc… In that sense I like to think of “Reichsfuhrer SS” as a monster movie.
Body Count Rising: With the hint of Nazi zombies in the credits of “Reichsfuhrer SS”, it almost seems like a setup for the next film. Should these two films be considered related, or are these films that should stand on their own?
John Martineau: Totally stand alone films.
David B. Stewart III: Yes, “Maplewoods” and “Reichsfuhrer SS” are by far stand alone movies. At one time there was some discussion or remaking “Maplewoods” and having a trilogy where the experiments of the Nazis in WWII would be shown, but those were scrapped because we just don’t have the money for such an elaborate set up and especially now where I believe movie making on our level is pretty much over.
Body Count Rising: Are there any plans for another film?
David B. Stewart III: Even if there is a future film in the realm of possibilities I’m “retired” as of now. However, if I get the filmmaking “bug” again, I want to make a Vietnam movie a story I’ve been working on that’s a mix of “Apocalypse Now”, “Platoon” and “The Devil’s Rejects”.
Body Count Rising: So what’s the scoop on the end credits zombies?
David B. Stewart III: The zombies in the end credit scene were mostly put in there to pay tribute to Bill Hinzman, a man who both John and I befriended around the time we were making our rounds at the horror conventions promoting “Maplewoods” in 2003. He was a great filmmaker whose impact is forever woven into the indie horror scene. How can anyone not appreciate “Flesh Eater”? The footage was originally shot for one of the nightmare sequences but deemed too cool for just a quick cut scene.
John Martineau: That footage was too cool to be so short and the credits seemed to be the best place for them. That shit was fun and dirty to shoot!
Body Count Rising: It was fun to view too! You actually dedicated the film to the memory of S. William Hinzman (Known for work in “Night of the Living Dead”, “FleshEater” and “The Crazies”)…
David B. Stewart III: He was originally going to play an aged Nazi General / Satanist in a movie entitled “Cult of the Dragon”. Unfortunately that production fell apart so we never did get to work with him, but I and a couple others did spend Halloween weekend with him and his family on his farm. It was funny. I was asleep on his couch when I awoke to sounds of groaning and moaning first thing in the morning. Of course it was Bill going through his morning routine and making some coffee. I laughed and said “
Bill I don’t know if you know this but you sound just like your zombie first thing in the morning.”
He laughed and said, “That’s just being old, you’ll sound like a zombie too someday. Want some coffee?”
John Martineau: He was a great friend and mentor to me. I miss him. He used to crack me up. He always had stories and he was hilarious! I do have some footage of Bill that hopefully one day I will be able to share. There is something in the works… RIP Bill.
Body Count Rising: When I initially started watching “Reichsfuhrer SS”, I thought it would be very similar to the Ilsa films of the 70’s, especially since it featured adult film star, Angelina Leigh. It is not. In fact it felt deliberately reserved, and only toward the end became more graphic. Why did you decide to hold back with regards to sex? For instance, during a felatio scene we only see Reichsfuhrer-SS Heinrich Himmler’s face contorting instead of Danuta’s head bobbing…
David B. Stewart III: It’s funny. There’s a photo of Angelina and Dyanne Thorne when they met at a convention, and they have a very striking resemblance. We had initially entertained the idea of remaking “Ilsa” with Angelina and Dyanne making a cameo. But for the most part I didn’t want the movie to be all about sex. The movie that inspired a lot of this one was Bruno Mattei’s “Private House of the SS” aka “SS Girls”. The character of “Shellenberg” is kind of how I geared the Heinrich Himmler character. Heinrich Himmler, and as far as I know, wasn’t a rapist, so I didn’t want to take the movie in that direction. That’s where Chuck Maher’s character comes in. I let his character do all the “dirty work.” And I liked the idea of Heinrich Himmler being the voyeuristic type of pervert. The whole Danuta dancing on the bed scene toward the end was a total unscripted add in for the exploitation fans.
Body Count Rising: Much like the sex, the violence escalated toward the end, becoming gradually more graphic. What was the most difficult effect or interaction to pull off and why?
David B. Stewart III: As this was our first time making this kind of movie, it wasn’t difficult but more awkward during some parts, especially shooting the rape scene between Angelina and Chuck. I have to say Angelina made it much easier because she is so open and wasn’t afraid of anything we asked her to do, or that we asked Chuck to do to her.
John Martineau: I have to agree with Dave I think the most awkward situation was the rape scene too. I was actually dreading shooting that until we talked to Angelina and she made everyone a lot more comfortable. Then I shot the hell out of it!
David B. Stewart III: Yes you did! We actually shot a lot of footage of that scene mainly because I wanted options as to how we could cut it together and what would work better. As for my interactions the most difficult was the dinner scene as a whole. It was one of the first scenes we shot at the cabin and directing and acting in that scene shot over three days was grueling. Not to mention hot, especially in that wool uniform!
Body Count Rising: Most of the cast spoke English with an American accent, but one of the soldiers spoke with what sounded like a British accent. You had German, Russian and British soldiers represented. Why not diversify the accents to match?
David B. Stewart III: Wow Suzie, you don’t pull any punches! (
laughing) It was a tribute to the over dubbed European Nazisploitation films from the 70s as the mix of accents.
Body Count Rising: Oh that makes sense! How much did you allow the cast to improvise, or did they stick strictly to the script?
David B. Stewart III: I am very loose when it comes to improv. I tell the cast all the time, if you think something will work, try it. If it doesn’t we’ll just shoot it again. I love it when someone comes up with something original and it sounds great. I wrote it but I’m always loose so I can’t be a stickler. Some of my best lines are off the cuff. Ask John.
John Martineau: Absolutely!
Body Count Rising: Did you use entirely practical effects, or did you use CG in the hell scenes in addition?
David B. Stewart III: I definitely wanted all the effects to be practical. For this I called upon an old friend from the Haunted Woods days, Heather McCook. She had always done makeup for the hayrides and for years said if I ever made another movie that she wanted to help out. She and Kat Pepe worked together to create all the practical effects for the movie, and needless to say I was very pleased with the results. For the demons in the “Hell” scenes I wanted to pay homage to the movie “Mausoleum”. I love to use lots of fake blood because I feel when the actors get “bloody” they can really put more into the performance. When I put together a team I want it to be a collaborative effort. I don’t feel it is right to dictate every single little detail because I believe the artists involved should have creative license. The only CG was enhancements to the atmosphere and color correction those effects were done by David Gechman who works a lot with Christian Grillo. He’s extremely talented and put a lot of time in on those.
Body Count Rising: Were multiple shots required, or were you able to do much of the filming in one take?
John Martineau: We never ever do anything in just one take no matter how good that first one was. There is always a safety. I would say we averaged about four takes per camera angle. Sometimes you get that one take that is gold, and other times you get the other take that has a better line in it. Options are the best thing to have! There were times I was running two cameras at the same time. The “Dinner” scene for instance was a two camera set up on the initial dialogue between Himmler and Danuta.
Body Count Rising: Do you have any fun or crazy stories from behind the scenes?
David B. Stewart III: The two weeks up at the cabin was interesting. We had no internet, no cell phones, no cable TV and the nearest place to get a decent cup of coffee was a 45 minute drive into town. So the first two weeks there some of us were struggling with the seclusion. Now I can do two months without any communication, no problem. I love the middle of nowhere, but it can be trying for some people, so there was a bit of drama the first few days of shooting.
John Martineau: Middle of nowhere was glorious! I do remember making one trip ten minutes away to get one bar of cell service that didn't hold just to check up on my kids, who also appear in the film. Morgan Elyse is my daughter.
David B. Stewart III: There were a lot of pranks, jokes, hot dogs, beer drinking, and your all around collegiate-style humor in our off hours. We usually shot all night and slept until 12:00 or 1:00 PM. So if we got four hours of sleep, we got a lot. This makes people very punchy. By the end of our shoot we were probably only two days away from murder-suicide but we got home OK. The funny stuff was in the details of the jokes, most of which were highly inappropriate, so I’ll leave those out. (laughing) I’m sure you can imagine. Maybe John will tell a few stories since he was the brunt of some of the jokes as well as a major roaster.
John Martineau: My one rule in life is to always have fun! Let’s put it this way. If we were a major corporation we would have been very HR inappropriate. There were tons of pranks and jokes. David reenacting Schwarzenegger in Predator drunk of his ass and almost setting himself on fire was just about the funniest, dumbest thing I ever saw! Deflating Ben Wesler’s air mattress in the morning almost became ritual! (laughing)
Body Count Rising: (laughing) What was your biggest challenge while working on “Reichsfuhrer SS”, and how did you overcome it?
David B. Stewart III: The biggest challenge for me was to direct and play the main part. It was tough at times to not be behind the camera and direct different aspects, but I guess that’s true of most people who have a foot on both sides. It was also challenging keeping things rolling during the breaks. We started shooting in September through October 2012 then had a break until the cabin shoot in May of 2013 then another break until we shot the “Hell” scenes in September 2013. The breaks were rough. I just wanted to get it done! It was great having John and Chris Grillo to help take up the reigns as AD’s when I just wanted to focus on the acting. Chris is great to work with, and he really knows what he wants when he shoots. I was totally comfortable having him direct the “Hell” sequences.
John Martineau: The hardest thing for me is always giving up the camera, but I had Christian Jude Grillo to take those reigns for me and I knew I had absolutely zero to worry about. Those “Hell” scenes are pretty bad ass! Thank you Christian!
David B. Stewart III: Yes, thanks to you both! You know, nothing ever goes as planned. One of our main characters quit. I re-wrote a lot of the story to accommodate the changes, but I realized we had already shot so much with him that we would have to get creative in our editing. This also included a total ADR of that character’s voice by someone else. (Easter egg spoiler)
John Martineau: I don’t think anyone ever has a film go as planned. Some things are just out of your control. People, budget, time etc... Like Dave said, we did have an issue where we had to do a complete rewrite on the fly. I kind of saw it coming so I had shot a ton more footage the night before then needed just in case and it paid off. The change itself was ultimately for the best. Thus the character of Kline was born.
Body Count Rising: Did you receive any backlash due to the topic of your film?
John Martineau: No backlash as of yet but it is still early in its release. Both the DVD and Blu-ray are already available Best Buy, Amazon, etc... The Blu-ray is gorgeous and has two cuts of the film on it. I’m sure once it hits the VoD market the haters are gonna hate, but we have been very lucky and grateful so far and have had quite a good bit of positive feedback.
Body Count Rising: Oh yeah,
Evan Stone is going to be in an upcoming mainstream WWII film where he plays a German soldier and someone reported his timeline photos from the film where he is in Nazi uniform. He said Facebook actually removed the photos!
David B. Stewart III: I haven’t gotten any backlash about the content. I find that the “backlash” is usually some miserable S.O.B. who just enjoys trashing movies in general.
Body Count Rising: I guess some people just like to complain…
John Martineau: There are those out there that this is not their kind of movie no matter how good or bad it is. In this business it’s going to happen. Just can’t worry about it. You can’t take it personally.
Body Count Rising: Has it been especially controversial as you are dealing with a supernatural portion of a real person’s life?
David B. Stewart III: I think enough time has passed for this whole Nazi subject that most people are OK with it being addressed.
Body Count Rising: Did playing Himmler take a toll on you?
David B. Stewart III: It sure did. The first time I put on that dreadful costume I felt dirty, evil and loathed. After the first day shooting I wasn’t even sure I wanted to continue. The only way I found in coping with the heavy feeling of playing such a criminal was to have a great sense of humor. I joked and laughed in between scenes as much as possible. I wanted to make sure everyone else felt comfortable. The important thing to me was that I was playing the character in a way that would be obvious to the viewer that I was not painting him in a sympathetic light. There is a clear arch to the character but not a good one.
Body Count Rising: You resemble him. Are you German as well?
David B. Stewart III: Actually looking like him was the only reason I wanted to play the part. It was creepy and uncanny how much I could resemble him. I can’t believe how different I look in that roll. It’s totally not me. I rock a beard and dress like Larry David. I am half German. Und Ich kann sprechen ein kleine Deutsch.
Body Count Rising: I’m half German too! Was it difficult to step out of character at the end of the day?
David B. Stewart III: It was totally difficult to step out of character, just ask the crew! Just kidding of course. RIGHT JOHN?! (laughing) As long as I had a beer at the end of shooting I was good.
John Martineau: Right! (laughing)
Body Count Rising: How much or your own military experience in played into the creation of the script, clothing and props?
David B. Stewart III: Well back in WWII when I was in the SS our uniforms were a little more starched and polished. (Kidding!) No, I’ve studied a lot of history and watch a lot of movies so when I set out to make this movie I really wanted to make sure the costumes were authentic looking. It was pricey but well worth it. It’s actually scary how much reproduction Nazi regalia is out there and easy to buy in bulk. I think there’s more of that stuff now than there ever was. If I had more budget I would have liked to have a couple old Mercedes cars in it and maybe a tank or two.
Body Count Rising: What is the most gratifying part about seeing your films made?
David B. Stewart III: I just enjoy the whole process of telling a visual story. I always did. I enjoy the idea that someday long after I’m gone, love it or hate it my movies will still be around for people to enjoy and get high to. It’s a bit of immortality that we can enjoy. I like the idea that it all starts with words in my head, then paper, then acted, then watched. It’s a great art form and like it or hate it, I love it.
John Martineau: Word for word what Dave said! My most gratifying thing is to be able to share with those who busted there asses to help us make it. Watch their eyes, their reactions and be able to talk about it afterwards.
Body Count Rising: Would you consider this a horror film, Nazisploitation, or both?
David B. Stewart III: I consider “Reichsfuhrer SS” more of a Psychological Thriller with hints of horror and Nazislpoitation. I can’t really call it either one as a whole because there are elements of both. It’s a modern interpretation of a lot of different influences.
Body Count Rising: Tina Krause played the sadistic and sensual Greta, snapping her whip at her hapless victims as they quivered in her wake. Is there any chance we could see the Greta character reprised in future films?
David B. Stewart III: I would love to make a film around Tina’s “Greta” that would be great, maybe her and Angelina as “Ilsa”! Tina is great, I have followed her movies since the 1990s and always wanted to work with her. When she agreed to play the part I was elated. Though if I could go back I would have had her dress tailored to accent her figure a bit more. She was great though wasn’t she? And Anthony really took those lashes through several takes.
John Martineau: I love Tina! She is 100% professional and a pleasure to work with. I had contacted her just before shooting and she was available. I would love to have her in another film. There is a possibility. Whether Greta or not I would cast Tina again in a heartbeat!
Body Count Rising: Between these two films you’ve been working steadily with still photography and behind the movie camera. What’s next for you?
John Martineau: As of right now I have actually been getting more back into acting. It was something I always enjoyed. I do have my own photography business as well which has been keeping me nice and busy. Dave had mentioned “Cult of the Dragon” which is a film we had planned to shoot twice. “Cult of the Dragon” may happen. It’s just a matter of when. And let me tell you, that script is intense!
Body Count Rising: Sounds great! Hey, I’ve heard of filmmakers presenting art shows of their films as still photography. Is that something you would consider doing?
John Martineau: I’ve not done that and I think both should be separate.
Body Count Rising: What’s the most valuable advice you could give to a filmmaker interested in filming the Nazi-horror genre?
David B. Stewart III: If you’re going to film a Nazi-themed movie spend a little time on the costumes and props. You can never have enough swastikas or eagles around. Gaudy is good. Everything seen in our frames was on purpose. Even the fact that the cabin had oak paneled walls was a reason it was chosen. Also don’t do what they do in a lot of sci-fi channel movies and give the Nazis plain uniforms with no insignia, medals or swastika bands. Do some research and try to be accurate. The frame is more than just the actor or actress. It is costume, set, etc... If we don’t care what the frame looks like why are we shooting movies?
John Martineau: Nazi genre is tough and a niche audience. First of all uniforms and props… get your history right! Do the research. If you are going to do it, do it right or wait till you can! It’s all in the details!
David B. Stewart III: Hey, if anyone needs some Nazi props or costumes I have a lot left that I can’t sell on eBay. They won’t allow it so they are just sitting in bins in my garage.
John Martineau: Don’t let Dave kid you. Those uniforms are in his closet upstairs. He is a sexy son of a bitch in that uniform. (laughing)
